buying a new pc

[Big Question]

lol
i appreciate anything you tell me, but theres no need to get all agressive about shit and completely disregard anything i say.

now let me explain myself.

My reasoning for saying i recommend a 500w psu (preferably more dependant on the exact spec) is that... and firstly i agree that heat would be more if the computer used all of the wattage available, and maybe i put this the wrong way but from what ive read/learnt is that a psu is most effective in terms of heat/quietness/efficeny when its working at around half of its recomended rated output. Its like anything going at full pedal the psu has to work harder...
plus say dude wants high end graphics in the future etc...you dont know.


its whatever, ive had my say and i personally wouldnt put a 400w in that system, it would be 600w.
thats going on what ive learnt over the years.

btw i dont have pc tech qualifications, i have a background in automotive electonics and know a little bit of the electrical stuff

[Chrit.]

I'd go for the 400w in that configuration. There is no way in hell it will even come close to putting a strain on that psu.

The noise difference for a studio PC would be decent between a 400w and a 600w.

Take a decent psu... and look at the dB levels even at idle.

500 Watt/ 17.6 dB(A)* in idle mode
600 Watt/ 19.6 dB(A)* in idle mode

And that is for a decent Nexus psu.

Why use something that will be 4dB louder when your system isnt going to tax the psu anyhow?

[Zed]

yo opey

USA 2 - UK 0

lol

[Big Question]

because it wont be louder running at around 350w...
and id be carefull in psu ratings, thats why id err on the side of caution

[Chrit.]

that system isnt going to force the psu to run at 350w anyhow.

running at 150-200 that 600w will still be running louder than the 400w.

[Opie M.]

Generally, electronics work most efficiently at about 3/4 of their maximum power. In audio, we call this unity gain or nominal gain. If you notice on mixer channel faders, they have a U at about 3/4 of the fader. Same applies with all amplifiers (the actual electronic component... not the device). Even when powering guitars, the best gain setting is about 3/4 of the max gain. When doing power calculation for circuit breakers, you calculate to only use 80% of the breaker's max amperage. This is the same concept.

What we're working with here is a PC that uses less than 150W of max power. Fully expanded, the computer only has the capacity to power about 300W worth of components, hence the 400W PSU giving 25% head room.

You are somewhat right about the heat. It won't be that much of a heat difference if the power isn't being used, but there will be added heat. And the fans inside have to be able to cool the PSU running a full 600W (your initial recommendation). In order to reduce the noise you have to buy a smart PSU that keeps track of temperature change and also has quiet fans. These are expensive (my initial point). I mean, would you rather have $100 worth of unnecessary power, or would you rather have more memory, more HD space, or a faster CPU?

I've been using 430W PSUs in my machines for awhile now. And most PC manufacturers use that or smaller. I haven't had one problem.

And about the video card... you're not supposed to be putting a high end gaming card in a studio PC. It's not for gaming. Those video cards actually have negative effects on the system performance. Even so... my PCs can handle an SLI configuration without problem.

[Big Question]

Generally, electronics work most efficiently at about 3/4 of their maximum power. In audio, we call this unity gain or nominal gain. If you notice on mixer channel faders, they have a U at about 3/4 of the fader. Same applies with all amplifiers (the actual electronic component... not the device). Even when powering guitars, the best gain setting is about 3/4 of the max gain. When doing power calculation for circuit breakers, you calculate to only use 80% of the breaker's max amperage. This is the same concept.

What we're working with here is a PC that uses less than 150W of max power. Fully expanded, the computer only has the capacity to power about 300W worth of components, hence the 400W PSU giving 25% head room.

You are somewhat right about the heat. It won't be that much of a heat difference if the power isn't being used, but there will be added heat. And the fans inside have to be able to cool the PSU running a full 600W (your initial recommendation). In order to reduce the noise you have to buy a smart PSU that keeps track of temperature change and also has quiet fans. These are expensive (my initial point). I mean, would you rather have $100 worth of unnecessary power, or would you rather have more memory, more HD space, or a faster CPU?

I've been using 430W PSUs in my machines for awhile now. And most PC manufacturers use that or smaller. I haven't had one problem.

And about the video card... you're not supposed to be putting a high end gaming card in a studio PC. It's not for gaming. Those video cards actually have negative effects on the system performance. Even so... my PCs can handle an SLI configuration without problem.

word if the system only require 200w then 400w is fine...
woot at being partially right tho

but is it not true that psu`s lose power over time depending on their usage level also? somthin bout electrolytic capacitor aging

[Opie M.]

You just surpassed the boundary of my expertise if that's the case lol

[Paragon]

Yea... this is basically the same PC I recommended without the good case, PSU, and second hard drive. It seems to be a good deal as far as buying from a manufacturer goes.The problem with this PC will be noise. Most likely, the case fans and the PSU will be loud. The PSU will be cheap. And, of course, no second HDD, which you can add.

Keep in mind that you're saving less than $150 on this model compared to mine, but it's coming with about $300 less worth of components, that you'll have to upgrade and add yourself to get it up to par with my configuration. And you're still not getting my Windows configuration either, which makes a big difference. If it was me, I'd spend the little bit of extra money to get the better PC. I mean, I could build this PC for you for less than they're charging, but there's no reason to for a small price difference. I don't understand the point of cutting corners here.

yeah i totally understand the shortcomings of the ibuypower build based on what you told me earlier. i really wish i could get your custom build but the fact is i literally only have this much to spend right now, as i don't have a job (or a car to drive to work even if i did) and am using financial aid money to pay for this (this can actually kinda be justified as a school expense since i'm a computer science major with a minor in music technology)

i wanted to save some cash for the nearfields because all i have is shitty 4-year-old eMachines stock speakers that have already popped from overuse and possibly my shitty amateur mixing, they go in and out as far as functioning goes

once i graduate and get a steady job i'm going to have plenty of extra money and i look forward to buying a pc from you if you still do this when that time comes (and the budget won't be as strict)

one other possibility is the Dell Vostro 420 that someone recommended to me

Intel Core 2 E7300
2GB of RAM
250 gb 7200 rpm hd
DVD Burner
ATI RADEON 3450 Video
integrated Audio
Firewire Card. (ti i think)
Microsoft Windows XP Home
1 year warranty

it comes almost to $700 but the misgivings i have is that its a dell, and i tried finding the motherboard type but the only thing i heard is that its a dell make and i don't know if it will be expandable, or if the motherboard is compatible with various audio needs

i think i should just get the ibuypower but idk

[Paragon]

this is what that same guy said in response to the same questions

You can't replace the Power Supply, and the motherboard. Thats the cost for getting OEM. Basic Upgrades are fine. Dells case probably will not allow you to stick a super highend Video card, but ram upgrades, and card upgrades will be just the same. You can't overclock it. I've been building computers for a while now if I've learned one thing, you cannot beat the deals OEMs get you at prices under a 800$ for a tower. At 800$ you just match them. A quality motherboard runs at least 100$, and you'll cut corners in things like PSU. From a purely functionality stand point as long as your not overclocking or doing fancy upgrades the dells do what there supposed to. Unlike a DIY PC you can't tweak the hell out of them, but thats the point of buying a shelf bought computer. It supposed to work more or less out of the box. The crucial components for compatibility for audio interfaces are in place, that is a quality chipset, and quality Firewire Chipset. Texas Instruments Firewire+ Intel Chipset+ relatively stable on Windows XP Pro. A little software tweaking and the whole thing is good to go. Its rather basic, but it does what your supposed to.

[Opie M.]

Word. I agree 100%. I've upgraded a PC using a Dell case before (for someone on RB actually) but it was no picnic. I wouldn't do it again. Manufacturers like Dell use different things that make it difficult to upgrade so you have to buy a completely new PC. I remember on the one I upgraded they had special fasteners on the motherboard that couldn't be unscrewed and stuff like that.

And to add to what he said, They make them so cheap because they cut corners as well (and they buy in bulk). You definitely get what you pay for. This is why I don't build cheaper PCs. Someone just looking for a basic PC to browse the net with might as well go with someone like Dell and get free shit like a monitor and/or a printer included.

[PeteFizzle]

yea u gotta have a gig ram for protools to even install. i had that problem so i upped my ram. pro-tools is the way to go though, u got a starter kit n shit that has production equip. wit it. ull see if u go that route.

[Big Question]

yeah the main reason you custom build a pc is to be able to manipulate it any way u want at a later date without being tied to particular hardware...also check the pc comes with a oem copy of windows as quite often manufacturers will only include a reload disc which is tied to the mobo installed. and a lot of the time it isnt always cheaper to build a pc of the same spec as you could buy one especially in the low end of the market. theres so much competition that prices are pretty competitive on retail pc`s. So if your not gon upgrade or want sumthin str8 out of the box theres a lot to be said for buying from somewhere like dell...but still dont do it lol. btw if you have a dell mobo already consider selling it on ebay...i remember needing a particular dell mobo for a pc that i had and the prices people were paying were stupid.

[Paragon]

ok so i should just get the ibuypower one? i'll probably upgrade it next semester, around august or september, as well as a new mic.


it's going to be primarily for recording anyway for the time being

[Opie M.]

Yea, if you get that one, just save for quiet power supply, CPU cooler, and fans.